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July 16, 2005


Jason Clark

wonderful, thank you Caroline..and please do say more :-)

Jason Clark

Dr MaryKate Morse, my disseration superviser, is bringing out a book called 'Bodied Leadership' based the idea that leadership is through presence in relationship. I wish you two could meet. Jason


I don't know what to say? Thank you, Caroline, so much.

This seems to have so many implications, provoke so many more questions and question so many more assertions.

Thanks - you continue to make my "job" so much harder! :-)

Let's get together and relate soon. ;-)


"There is not such thing as leadership. Leaders are not born, made or individuals..."

This makes me think "yes" and "no" (good Anglican that I am!!) - yes, wonderful to think that leadership is not a THING. Leadership is something that happens among a group of people when one or more persons become the catalyst for the group to act. But as to whether leaders are not born... I would have been more persuadable to this view before I had my son. Watching him play in the playground the year before he started school, there were undeniably some kids that were "born" leaders, and others who were "born" loners and others who were "born" contemplatives... Whatever the nature/nurture mix is, it is pretty deeply ingrained by the time they are 5. Maybe, then, the activists need to be trained to listen very carefully to the kids who sit in the corner dreaming big dreams... THe ones with the really good ideas are not always the ones who get to lead the group. Not in the playground at any rate.

Thanks for more good thoughts!

Jason Clark

I had to come back Caroline, your post ha shad me mulling over and thinking since I read it.

When the metaphor of the modern world was machine, system, and acheiving a goal was the object, we used people.

But leadership is relational, not a mechanism. Leadership is incarnational, prescence based.

And bringing relationship to others in relationship, visioneering of goals gets replaced with leading others into presence, with community, god and the world.

Reminded me of Shackleton and that all the great leaders in history had prescence and relational intelligence.

Thanks for your posting, do some more , please.


Wes Roberts

Caroline...I've only read your first paragraph...and will go back and read the rest in a bit...BUT...please Do NoT stop writing on this topic. I/we/others need your insights and guidance. I welcome it...sincerely. OK? OK. Now...I'll go back and read the rest of your post....... :)

Wes Roberts

...ok (and I've not changed one iota from what I wrote in the previous post)...more glad than ever for what you have written. Thank you!

Having lunch today with one of the young emerging business leaders of our community, what you wrote was part of the topic of our conversation. "Presence" is a significant missing element in the development of many relationships...especially, it seems...among many leaders. My friend today asked, since were on the topic even before reading your blog, "Can 'presence' be taught...or only modeled, experienced, and thus taught?" What would your answer be if you had been in on the conversation?

PS...you are welcome over here any time for lunch...and much more. :)

susiealbert miller

i have to echo the comments above. please continue to write on this important subject. your voice and insights are so important.

btw, & imho, i think presence mus be modeled... that is the hebraic way as talked about in deuteronomy, "as you sit, as you walk by the way" as well as the way that Jesus, the Hebrew, taught and led his disciples and followers during his time on earth. I think that "presence," our truly being aware and engaged in the moment with another's life, story, journey, thoughts, ideas, struggles, etc is the fundamental part of leadership that makes mankind essentially not a machine! Presence is the offering of the soul, of the senses and what causes people to want to follow and to share...


one of the key ideas of biblical leadership must be that of joshua and the idea that moses leadership would get you out of egypt but only joshua leadership would get you into canaan. infact, the book of joshua starts with the information that moses is dead.

if we are not to follow leaders as people [and look for joshua leaders], then can we look for things/systems/groups that embody joshua type processes? this is likely to be rather more agressive, subversive and direct than many pomo collagues would appreciate (eg, joshua 2v1: secretly) - but it does seem to be in scripture...

maybe you can re-tell the traditional john c maxwell reading of joshua from a process point of view?

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